Jays @ Sox Marcum vs. El Loco July 13, 2007

[SamBam39]

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Marcum
4-3, 3.62 (http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/stats/individual_player_gamebygamelog.jsp?playerID=45178 8&statType=2)

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@
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Tavarez
5-7, 4.97 (http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/stats/individual_player_gamebygamelog.jsp?playerID=12311 8&statType=2)


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Friday the 13th will be lucky for the Sox!!

Good start to the second half last night. Good RBI production from Papi and Manny. Now the Nation wil keeps it's fingers crossed and await the results of the MRI! Lugo showing signs off life.

IMPORTANT NEWS FLASH..............
This just into the Red Sox Nation News Desk. Dateline Boston, Massachusetts. Doug Mirabelli is still FAT!!!!! Thank you.

Hoping for the 6-7 inning good El Loco tonight. I will post lineups later today!!

[SamBam39]

Boston
1. J.D. Drew, RF
2. Dustin Pedroia, 2B
3. David Ortiz, DH
4. Manny Ramirez, LF
5. Kevin Youkilis, 1B
6. Mike Lowell, 3B
7. Jason Varitek, C
8. Coco Crisp, CF
9. Julio Lugo, SS
SP -- Julian Tavarez
Toronto
1. Vernon Wells, CF
2. Reed Johnson, LF
3. Alex Rios, RF
4. Frank Thomas, DH
5. Troy Glaus, 3B
6. Lyle Overbay, 1B
7. Aaron Hill, 2B
8. Gregg Zaun, C
9. John McDonald, SS
SP -- Shaun Marcum

[Patriots4ever]

In honor of Friday the 13th and Wholian...

http://flathat.wm.edu/2003-08-22/freddie.jpg

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Nice, T ends the first with a big K

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Hahaha! Take THAT, shift!

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Hey, guess what, Manny's back :D

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Hehe. Yooks looks so funny when he thinks he's running fast.

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Nice DP. Good job of Tavarez getting over there and making the stretch

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Close play. Tavarez is livin on the edge, but he's gettin er done so far.

[SamBam39]

El Loco over 40 pitches. He may not make it to the 5th!!!

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

O, come on, he didn't even try to get out of the way, that's horsepoopie

[SamBam39]

This guy is such a fifth pitcher!!!

[SamBam39]

Ah man!!!! Hey stupid you are missing a good game!

[SamBam39]

Tonight will be a night the bp will earn it's money!!!

[SamBam39]

Thanks for wasting Manny's HR you piece of shlT

[SamBam39]

TB up 3-0 over the MFY's!!! Clemens pitching.

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Jeezus H this is painful to watch. When do we get Lester back?

[SamBam39]

I think it is becoming painfully evident that the Sox arte going to have to find a better solution for the 5th starter. Lester is not the answer yet. Maybe in Aug or Sept when he straightens out his control issues. Maybe when Schilling comes back they can bring back Gabbard....I don't know!!! But something needs to be done!!!

[SamBam39]

Please take him out!!

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Out at the plate! And that horror of an inning is finally over

[theyellowdart]

I think JT has officially hit the wall... He isn't fooling anyone...

[SamBam39]

Dear Terry, How much longer are you going to go with Tavarez tonight? Just wondering. How many runs would be too many in your mind? 6-8-10 would 12 get you off your @ss and calling for a new pitcher? Just wondering. While you are busy "saving" the bullpen THE SOX ARE BUSY LOSING!!!!!

[SamBam39]

First pitch swinging Dustin!!! You know better!

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Sweet, Manny drives in his 3rd run of the night.

[SamBam39]

Manny coming up big tonight!!!

[SamBam39]

Well gets the job done sort of!!!!

[southcarolina]

Im home....and slowass Mike Lowell hits a triple.


man i am awesome.

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

And LOWELL makes everything all better again!! YAY!!!!!!

[SamBam39]

I love Mike Lowell!!!!!!

[southcarolina]

Is anyone else having issues getting into the Mother Planet?

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

Yeah, the Mother Planet is having issues

[southcarolina]

Yeah, the Mother Planet is having issues


OK. I thought maybe UT had finally gotten tired of my act and gave me the whole "Database Error" trick banning.

[SamBam39]

So what's the over under on how many runs the Jays get in the top of the 4th?

[theyellowdart]

I am just going to close my eyes for the top half of this inning... Hopefully it works out...

[southcarolina]

Uh oh Drew hurt?

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

So what's the over under on how many runs the Jays get in the top of the 4th?

I think the first batter hits into a triple play and the innign is over before ya know it.

[SamBam39]

Uh oh Drew hurt?
I think it's his time of the month!!!

[southcarolina]

Julian is getting squeezed!!!!

[EverettsTheoryOfEvolution]

What a sorry little hit. Boo. :(

[southcarolina]

That auction would be cool to go to. They said last night they were having a night of bowling with Julian Tavares. I would bid on that.

[SamBam39]

Julian is getting squeezed!!!!
I'd like to squeeze his stupid pin head until it explodes!!!

[SamBam39]

96 pitches! I hope he is done!!!

[SamBam39]

Covelli due!!!!

[southcarolina]

Lugo is coming around. Solid contact, just right at someone. I predict he hits .540 the second half, making his season batting average .285.

[SamBam39]

NEWS FLASH Nancy Drew out with sprained vagina! Sox lack of bench depth coming back to haunt them as Mr. .193 comes in to replace him!!:icon_hang

[SamBam39]

WHY IS TAVAREZ STILL IN THE GAME??????:icon_fU: :icon_fU:

[SamBam39]

Another reason why Francona is an idiot. Rather than letting Snyder start the inning he lets Tavarez give up a lead off hit so Snyder comes in with a runner on base!!! Why is that necessary?

[southcarolina]

man i love defense :)

[pookie]

Another reason why Francona is an idiot. Rather than letting Snyder start the inning he lets Tavarez give up a lead off hit so Snyder comes in with a runner on base!!! Why is that necessary?

Would Francona be an idiot if Glaus had grounded out?

Best

Record

In

Baseball

[southcarolina]

WHY IS TAVAREZ STILL IN THE GAME??????:icon_fU: :icon_fU:

Giving him a shot at the win.

[SamBam39]

Nice play by Mike Lowell.

[SamBam39]

Would Francona be an idiot if Glaus had grounded out?

Best

Record

In

BaseballWhat was the purpose of bringing Tavares out? He's a 100 yrs old and was at a 100 pitches. He wasn't effective tonight anyway. So why not go to the long relief. Not like they are burned out or anything! And give the guy clean bases. Just doesn't make any sense. That's my opinion.

[southcarolina]

Would Francona be an idiot if Glaus had grounded out?

Best

Record

In

Baseball

Ho pookie. Will it help get PP back up and running if i refresh my Patriots Planet page over and over, and send an email to the Tech staff every minute or so?

[SamBam39]

Giving him a shot at the win.
More like a loss!!! This is pros not little league. The object is to win the GAME. Not get your ineffective pitcher the win!

[southcarolina]

More like a loss!!! This is pros not little league. The object is to win the GAME. Not get your ineffective pitcher the win!

I must have missed the part where the Blue Jays scored some more runs :)

[SamBam39]

Wow! Surprising, Manny just looked at three straight strikes!!!

[SamBam39]

Marcum getting the benefit of some nice calls!!

[southcarolina]

Swing.The.Bat.


That is all.

[SamBam39]

I must have missed the part where the Blue Jays scored some more runs :)
I think you know what I meant!!! Tavarez was not getting a win at the rate he was going...that's all.

[pookie]

Ho pookie. Will it help get PP back up and running if i refresh my Patriots Planet page over and over, and send an email to the Tech staff every minute or so?

Sure, that'll do it!! Either that or fix the sql issue that seems to be going on with the database.

[southcarolina]

I think you know what I meant!!! Tavarez was not getting a win at the rate he was going...that's all.

At the rate he was going.... you mean giving up one less run than the offense had scored up until that point? Thats called winning. Ugly, sure. But winning. If youre winning, and the pitcher isnt dead, you trot him out for the top of the fifth and tell him one baserunner and youre finished. If he goes 1-2-3, he qualifies for the win. One baserunner, and the BP takes over. Thats the kind of thing you have to do when you manage people (as opposed to say fantasy baseball) People have feelings and emotions, and sometimes you have to give a guy his shot.

And besides, it worked. Snyder got out of the inning. :icon_eyes

[southcarolina]

Snyder, btw, is a former #6 overall draft pick of the Royals. I had no clue.

[southcarolina]

Fuggin Kyle Snyder. get a haircut ya fuggin hippie :)

[southcarolina]

yes. Good thing we got Tavares out of there :)


:p

[southcarolina]

Ok, just to even things out, i am now going to irrationally hate Kyle Snyder for the rest of the season.

next year, instead of Adopt a Sox, we should all pick a guy we are going to hate irrationally.


Dammit ya former #6 overall draftpick!!!!

[SlumpBustR]

Sure, that'll do it!! Either that or fix the sql issue that seems to be going on with the database.

RG:sql issue??? what is it?

UT:it's a problem that there are not enough squirrels running the wheel to keep the Planet up, but that's not important now -- how about them RedSox???

[southcarolina]

if its a squirell issue, you need to get The Big Lebowski involved

[SlumpBustR]

if its a squirell issue, you need to get The Big Lebowski involvedthe squirrels have gotten to Clemens too

top of 7th, 5- 1 Tampa Bay

Yankees can't gain on us tonite looks like :icon_fU:

[southcarolina]

the squirrels have gotten to Clemens too

top of 7th, 5- 1 Tampa Bay

Yankees can't gain on us tonite looks like :icon_fU:

But...i thought Clemens was going to fix the Spankees.

[southcarolina]

Cmon Coco

[SamBam39]

At the rate he was going.... you mean giving up one less run than the offense had scored up until that point? Thats called winning. Ugly, sure. But winning. If youre winning, and the pitcher isnt dead, you trot him out for the top of the fifth and tell him one baserunner and youre finished. If he goes 1-2-3, he qualifies for the win. One baserunner, and the BP takes over. Thats the kind of thing you have to do when you manage people (as opposed to say fantasy baseball) People have feelings and emotions, and sometimes you have to give a guy his shot.

And besides, it worked. Snyder got out of the inning. :icon_eyes
You thought Tavarez had something left. I didn't.

[southcarolina]

You thought Tavarez had something left. I didn't.


Ok.


I still :icon_syda you.




:)

:icon_pidu

[southcarolina]

All i know is that we would still be winning if that idiot Francona hadnt put in that god awful Snyder. Damn you Theo and John Henry for putting together this horrible team.


*goes to burn his RedSox footie jammies*

[luso2kx]

"...but, he's JUST A FIFTH STARTER..."

uh huh...

[elsid13]

OK what happened to "DL" Drew?

[luso2kx]

Pineiro in the 9th while we're down by 1 run.

Yeah, but Francona isn't to blame for this one...

[SlumpBustR]

OK what happened to "DL" Drew?his labia and/or hamstring prolly tightened up on her

Pineiro in the 9th while we're down by 1 run.

Yeah, but Francona isn't to blame for this one...listen, you just do not understand -- a manager has to manage to get all "his young men" into the game to keep the team fresh and everyone focused and alert otherwise he will lose the team to boredumness and other kind of basebally stuff

duh :icon_eyes

[luso2kx]

So Lopez is coming in.....and Okajima and Papelbon are nowhere to be found.

Tito Gaston strikes again!

[luso2kx]

10 to 1 Tito doesn't have Cora come in and PH for Lugo right now.

[theyellowdart]

10 to 1 Tito doesn't have Cora come in and PH for Lugo right now.

I am kind of happy that Tito is the manager and your not... No offense...

[luso2kx]

I am kind of happy that Tito is the manager and your not... No offense...Yeah, because he actually got lucky with Timlin (who has the RF in Fenway to thank for not allowing one more run to score), Pineiro and Lopez, as well as Lugo's hit.

Still doesn't mean he made the right decisions.

[theyellowdart]

Yeah, because he actually got lucky with Timlin (who has the RF in Fenway to thank for not allowing one more run to score), Pineiro and Lopez, as well as Lugo's hit.

Still doesn't mean he made the right decisions.

Whatever you say... I would rather have Tito over many other Managers in the game. Every single manager makes mistakes and takes chances... I get questioning him at times because that what baseball is all about. But calling him Tito Gaston and a below average manager is where I part company with you. I think he is a damn good manager and am happy he is the one of my team

[luso2kx]

Whatever you say... I would rather have Tito over many other Managers in the game. Every single manager makes mistakes and takes chances... I get questioning him at times because that what baseball is all about. But calling him Tito Gaston and a below average manager is where I part company with you. I think he is a damn good manager and am happy he is the one of my teamIt helps to have a team with the 2nd highest payroll in the Majors. Good for covering up bad decisions.

And I don't understand the facination with this guy. 2004 was 3 years ago and, since then, we ate a big one in the 2005 ALDS, collapsed last year and, after a strong start this year, we're now playing BELOW .500 since June 1st.

If Francona was managing a team like the Twins, I have no doubt in my mind that they would be near dead last in their division. People give way too much credit to Francona while not realzing the amount of high-paid talent the Sox have.

[Mark_Henderson]

So Lopez is coming in.....and Okajima and Papelbon are nowhere to be found.

Tito Gaston strikes again!


He was holding them in reserve in case we tied the game. If we don't tie it, they're better off with a day's rest for tomorrow.

[luso2kx]

He was holding them in reserve in case we tied the game. If we don't tie it, they're better off with a day's rest for tomorrow.Yeah, not like winning was an option...

That's the main pet peeve I have with Francona. He manages scared. Rather than trying to go for the kill, he simply decides to wait. Doesn't want to take the risk. That's why he kept Timlin for 2.1, that's why he opted for Pineiro and Lopez rather than Okajima, that's why he kept Cora on the bench.

Annoys the hell out of me. All that talent on that team and he is afraid to use alot of it.

[theyellowdart]

It helps to have a team with the 2nd highest payroll in the Majors. Good for covering up bad decisions.

And I don't understand the facination with this guy. 2004 was 3 years ago and, since then, we ate a big one in the 2005 ALDS, collapsed last year and, after a strong start this year, we're now playing BELOW .500 since June 1st.

If Francona was managing a team like the Twins, I have no doubt in my mind that they would be near dead last in their division. People give way too much credit to Francona while not realzing the amount of high-paid talent the Sox have.

2005 Starting Rotation
David Wells- Opening day starter :blink:
Matt Clement Made all star team but really took a nose dive in the second half
Bronson- Good pitcher but not someone that is going to take you to the promise land
Wakes- Is what he is
Wade Miller among others that I will not name because it is pretty embarrassing :blink:

Schilling had a awful year following his heroics of the 2004 playoffs. He didn't make many starts and was the closer for a little while :icon_eyes

The only good arm in the pen that year was Timlin until Paps came up and was put to the Pen in september. Foulke was just god awful and was never the same after 2004

The Offense was very good.... I will not deny that..

Name me a manager that would take that pitching staff anywhere? I think they went as far as they were going to go.

Yes they had a huge payroll but the quality of arms was laughable. If you have a beef with anyone, maybe it should be Theo.

Now the 2006 season, the injury bug hit the team big time... Are you really going to blame "Tito Gaston" for that? That season was doomed from the moment Theo left Fenway in a gorrilla suite...

That is all I got

[NEM]

It's hard to come down on Francona when the team is 10 games, or so, ahead in the standing.

Even if they only play .500 ball the rest of the season. Toronto or the Yankees would have to go something like, 50-26, or so, to catch them. (More of less, I didn't figure it out)

I do, however, agree that I can't stand Snyder either. And, as I stated in another thread, I have never been high on Tavarez. He is, at best, a 4 or 5 inning pitcher. (Yeah, I know he had a couple of solid long outings)

Tavarez just doesn't seem to have anything on the ball, and good hitting teams will eat him up alive.

Schilling needs to come back ready to pitch. He just doesn't seem to have the killer instinct anymore... and on many occasions, he seems to let up when he is 0-2 on batters and they have taken him to school many times.

I still believe, however, that Francona lets the starters stay in for, maybe, a couple of batters too long, and then, its too late, the damage has been done.

But, like another poster said, I too am not the manager, merely an educated onlooker, like most of us. My expertise, as many who know me understand, is in the field of football offensive play calling. Always willing to lend a helping hand. :icon_eyes

[Mark_Henderson]

Yeah, not like winning was an option...

That's the main pet peeve I have with Francona. He manages scared. Rather than trying to go for the kill, he simply decides to wait. Doesn't want to take the risk. That's why he kept Timlin for 2.1, that's why he opted for Pineiro and Lopez rather than Okajima, that's why he kept Cora on the bench.

Annoys the hell out of me. All that talent on that team and he is afraid to use alot of it.


I understand what you're saying, but they have to be be careful not to overuse Papelbon and Okie's thrown a lot of innings AND Francona's gamble paid off.

If there's anything I would have handled more aggressively last night, it would have been to have Lugo stealing once he got on base in the 9th. The Jays catcher has awful numbers throwing people out. If Lugo could have been on 3rd when Papi flied to center, we would have tied the game.

[NEM]

If there's anything I would have handled more aggressively last night, it would have been to have Lugo stealing once he got on base in the 9th. The Jays catcher has awful numbers throwing people out. If Lugo could have been on 3rd when Papi flied to center, we would have tied the game.

I agree in total with that. At that stage of the game, it was worth a shot, and my guess is that the Jays wouldnt have been looking for it, not figuring we would take a gamble on the tying run not being on base any more.

Lugo was the right guy to have on base, at the right time. Francona should have pulled the trigger. You are correct.